Texas gets open carry for handguns come Friday for those with concealed carry licenses. There’s a lot of confusion and anxiety among some. There’s also anti-gun groups who have advocated to their supporters that they call 9-1-1 and “SWAT” the open carrier by claiming to the 9-1-1 operator that the open carrier is acting erratically, threateningly or menacingly to those around. The idea is to trigger a large police response and make life miserable for the legal open carrier.
Gun Stories of the Week: Group Vows to Call 911 on Concealed and Open Carry Permit Holders
Group’s ‘SWATting’ tactic puts legal gun owners, police in crosshairs
The Coalition to Stop Gun Violence (CSGV) has again taken to social media to urge its paranoid stooges to call 911 if they see anyone openly or concealed carrying a firearm, setting the stage for unnecessary and potentially lethal confrontations between legal gun owners and nervous police.
…In an Oct. 2 National Review article, Charles Cooke studied the comments on GSGV’s Facebook page, Twitter page and website and uncovered startling and scary threats by people who, apparently, aren’t just opposed to individual ownership of firearms, but violently hate those who own guns.Cooke writes that while scrolling through their website commentary, “every 20 comments or so, one sees dangerously inflammatory rhetoric.”
Cooke cites these examples:
—“You see a GunFilth waving its penis substitute, exit, call police. Armed robbery in progress.” — Twitter user “Little Black Dog” on Sept. 13, 2014
—Reacting to a photograph of a man standing at a checkout with a handgun holstered upon his hip, a “mom-who-demands-action” Joyce Ward asks, “Why weren’t the police called immediately?” And “why,” Ward continues, “wasn’t he shot by the police for having a weapon?”
—Fellow poster Lisa McLogan Shaheen has a similar inquiry, wondering, “Why hasn’t someone called 911 so the cops can gun him down?”
—“Every time I see someone with a gun in a store I will call 911,” Jennifer Decker vows, “they’ll get tired of that right quick!!!”
—“Just call the police every time you see someone with one,” Ann Marie counsels, “the police will get sick of it eventually or have a run in with one of these clowns and then things will change.”
Houston has put up a Q&A webpage, and reading between the lines, they plan to go after any so-called “activists” who place false 9-1-1 calls against open carriers.
Question: If I see a person open carrying a handgun, should I call the police?
Answer: Yes you can call the police, but before you call, observe how the person is acting. If they are acting suspicious, or enter a building such as a school, then please give us a call. But, if they are simply at a gas station filling up their car, then they are probably a law abiding citizen who is legally open carrying.Question: Some organizations that are in opposition to open carry, have said that if they see someone openly carrying a handgun, they will call 911 and say that person is being aggressive and threatening people with the weapon. How will the police handle situations like this.
Answer: The police will act with caution when approaching the person, they will collect the facts, and when it is found that this person was doing nothing wrong, the investigation will be turned towards the person who made the false 911 call.
Wouldn’t it be really sweet to see a successful prosecution for a malicious 9-1-1 call.
That would be almost as delicious as that guy that got convicted for attacking the black concealed carry licensee in Florida a year or two ago. For some reason, he thought he was doing a public service by tackling and wrestling with the CCWer.
He’s lucky he didn’t get shot and the cops that showed up didn’t give him a pat on the back, but a pat on the head as they loaded him into the back seat in handcuffs. That’s the way it should be.
What we don’t want is wannabe heroes–that kind of ignorance can only cause problems
Oh so you’d rather see an innocent person who is exercising their rights shot because some idiots are scared of any kind of gun? Call in all the fake reports and get people shot because you’re ignorant.
I’m glad liberalism is not contagious.
It can’t be contagious because it a mental health disorder. Research on Google Liberalism is a mental disorder,
I heard that you can CATCH liberalism from a TOILET SEAT! It’s right there with VD and genital HERPES.
Big deal!
Texas acts like they have a tough conservative state and they now “allow” open carry BUT, you still need a permit and have to surrender ID if stopped by a cop for carrying. In VT (very liberal) and ME you need no permits for firearms at all and in NH only for concealed carry all allow open carry. You can not be stopped simply for open carrying and you have no obligation to present ID if you are.
Well aren’t you just something else Frigman.
I agree having to have a license to exercise a right is my government stealing that right and selling it back to me.
I agree with you 100%, and am waiting for true Constitutional open carry. I hope you have the greatest New Year!
yeah, but you got bernie sanders- c’mon down here and see the toughness for yourself
Cops wont be allowed to stop us for just open-carrying either. Nor will we have to present ID unless we are acting illegally. And you only need a permit to carry a handgun, long gun public carry has been legal forever. At least here if I see someone open-carrying, I know they have more firearm trainging than just the ability to say “I’ll take the shiny one”.
@OCT: I know I’m gonna catch hell for this, but your statement is, in my opinion, the very reason we probably SHOULD have licensing for folks to carry. I LIKE knowing current CHL/LTC holders have had more training than playing GTA on Xbox. We license drivers under the same conditions. Train, test, show proof when asked. Cars are dangerous, too. Should we stop licensing drivers as well? I fully support the right to bear arms, in whatever permutation it presents itself. For my own sake, I’ll be a little less jumpy knowing those showing at least know a little bit about how to handle themselves.
TXopencarry, I believe you might want to check your facts. Many attorneys have stated a police officer CAN stop you solely because you are open carrying. This is allowed because they can state they have probably cause against penal code 46.02, it is illegal to have on or about you, a handgun, illegal knife or club. The exemption being your identification that in fact you have a LTC, or CHL. Many attorneys have stated this, and until there is case law against it, law enforcement can stop you.
I believe J Po is wrong. The 4th amendment protects against illegal search and seizure. However I believe case law will in time clear this difference of opinion.
Yeah, well, driving a car is not a Constitutional right, either.
“At least here if I see someone open-carrying, I know they have more firearm training than just the ability to say “I’ll take the shiny one”.
This is the absolute best response I have ever read regarding why Texas has licensing for all carry..
@TXopencarry – You need to check your facts, guy. The Dutton/Huffines Amendment to House Bill 910 would have prevented officers from stopping a person solely because they were open carrying. This amendment did not pass and was removed from the bill. Officers can, and in many of the more liberal cities have stated they WILL, stop and ID a person who is open carrying. It is your right to refuse to present identification, but that in and of itself is a class c misdemeanor and could result in a trip to jail anyway. Don’t cause problems where they don’t exist. Most cops are pro-gun and just want to make sure Johnny Felon isn’t trying to blend in with the crowd.
Battleborn is correct on all counts. Yes, a Peace Officer can ask to see your carry license and yes, the majority of Peace Officers in Texas are pro 2nd ammendment.
While it may be a class c misdemeanor not to provide ID when asked. It is also a constitutional violation to require you to provide identification. Do your attorneys suck that bad in the TX that they can’t get that law removed from the books?
@J Po, in the state of texas if I am walking down the street and am open carry then Texas Penal Code 38.02 states:
http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/Docs/PE/htm/PE.38.htm
PENAL CODE
TITLE 8. OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC ADMINISTRATION
CHAPTER 38. OBSTRUCTING GOVERNMENTAL OPERATION
Sec. 38.02. FAILURE TO IDENTIFY. (a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally refuses to give his name, residence address, or date of birth to a peace officer who has lawfully arrested the person and requested the information.
You have to be under lawful arrest to be forced to ID yourself. If you are driving your car you have to show your drivers license.
This is to bat driving in a car isn’t a constitutional right but traveling is and you ha e the right to travel in your personal property as you please that is a constitutional right and it does not require a driver’s license
I remember i ca . In the 60s and probably 70s . People would drive around with rifles on their back window in pick up trucks.i was just a kid then . Not sure what the law was then
I’m sure someone has already said this but yea, you do have to present your ID – even if you’re just pumping gas. That amendment did not pass … Please know the law before you open carry. It could make for a long day for you.
No permit in Texas,I can buy and own what ever I want and carry in my vehical,license to carry yes.
No permit needed in Arizona for open or concealed carry, the police cannot search you for weapons unless they have reason to suspect you are in the commission of a crime, I got stopped once because I fit the description and was very politely disarmed. Plus we have no duty to inform an officer we are armed during traffic stops.
When stopped by an officer in texas while driving a vehicle you are not required by law to inform the officer that you have a firearm concealed in your vehicle
@Shiela seriously? Are you referring to carrying concealed or the MPA? because you very much do have to display your license at a stop and disclose your firearm.
TEX GV. CODE ANN. § 411.205 : Texas Statutes – Section 411.205: DISPLAYING LICENSE; PENALTY
Indiana is either or as long as you have a permit, no question about it
Frigman– Although technically you’re right, here in Maine, you ARE afforded privileges that you would have otherwise if you still have a CCP, such as being able to carry a laded weapon in a vehicle. If you don’t have a permit, you have to unload it when you get in a car. Mine stays cocked and locked. That’s just one example. There ARE many others.
The Texas law states that a carrier CANNOT be stopped by the police just on the basis of their openly carrying a gun.
Dude. Yes they can. The Dutton Amendment did not pass. Please research the state law before you decide to open carry.
You do NOT have to “surrender” your i.d., whatever you may have meant by that, you seem to be misinformed. You must show your CHL and your DL to an officer. If you do not have a CHL and you are traveling you can still carry a handgun in TX providing that it is stowed away out of site. Always tell the officer about it if pulled over. We are very gun friendly. And it isn’t the Texans that are making the big deal out of getting open carry, it is the rest of the country. Not many of us will choose to openly wear our firearms, rather conceal them beneath our clothing. It’s a better idea. The rest of the country always makes a big deal out of what goes on in Texas. Because Texas is where the bar is set.
So, you’re saying the conservative state is more careful about open carry than a liberal state?
Let me find my shocked expression.
Where is all the paranoia coming from? Generally it is the by-product of no understanding and lacking education. We in the U.S. do not advocate exposure and training to firearms at an early age. We opt to “save” that for career path decisions. If you recognize and understand what it is that you are seeing AND STOP buying into media driven sensationalism, all this paranoia goes away.
Face it people – turn on the TV – flip through all the movie channels and TV “shows”. It is easier to count the ones without violence than with. We do not live in a rode-colored world – stop pretending that we do. But if you persist – go ahead make that 911 call and you can sit in jail with REAL CRIMINALS !!! Then and only then will you think perhaps for yourself and decide to just leave us alone. Thank you – now go make your call.
Actually, for those who do make fake 911 calls and get caught, they will be able to hang with the thugs in jail for a little while. Maybe once they get out of jail, they too will want to take a class and get their permit to carry a weapon? LOL! This may be a good way to get some of the goofy liberals to understand why people carry a weapon.
True except for one minor detail.
At that point they will have a criminal record which bars them from obtaining a CHL / LTC.
This would not be a felony charge, so they would still be able to get a LTC.
@Festus…False, the only things that will keep you from getting a firearm or a concealed carry are a felony or any kind of abuse charges on your record.They frown on giving wife beaters permits…
@Festus making a false 911 call in Texas is a Class A Misdemeanor unless it’s at a certain area such as a school, then it’s a state jail felony. You cannot have a LTC with a Class A or B, disorderly conduct, or felony. http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/Docs/PE/htm/PE.42.htm read the penalty under 42.06
This article is pointless!! Cops will even tell you “I would rather see a subject with an openly displayed firearm than one concealed!”
What difference does it make? You are either packing or not packing!! But how is irrelevant !!
Actually, those making those fake 911 calls, will tha after being booked and going to the thank, they will be convicted felons. Thereby not able to own, carry or obtain a CCW… The joke is on them
Awwww, darn. Anti-gun zealots taking themselves out of the voting pool… I guess this is a problem that takes care of itself.
Sounding more and more like a great problem to have.
I can’t help but wonder why so many chiefs of police are against open carry.
I haven’t seen that they are. Those that are, are politicians, not beat cops seeing real life day in and day out.
Politicians fear open carry, because they fear an armed populace; being reminded that we keep the means to defend our liberties gives them pause.
Your day-to-day cop just trying to go home to his family every night probably understands that the average OCer is a lot less likely to be a criminal than someone who stuffs a gun into their waistband sans holster.
That was a poll done by none other than an anti group… And remember, chiefs/commissioners are either appointed or elected, so many play politics over principle.
This is a lot of hype that over time will diminish in a few months. If cities prosecute 911 abusers, this will end. Idiots on both sides of this subject need to be prosecuted.
If you carry a gun and stupidly go showing off, you need a time out in a barred box, weather you have a CHL/LTC or not. Just remember why you have decided to carry, for self protection.
If you are one of the liberal idiots who think filling a police officers day with useless and annoying make work situations by calling 911, and full well knowing the new law, then you too should spend a little time in the barred bow. Maybe a nice little $500 addition to the city general fund straight out of your pocket would insert a little missing common sense.
As when the CHL’s first became legal, there was all kinds of hysteria, on how Texas was going to become a killing field. More idiot liberal media hype.
I have been asking cops in my area their opinion and not one has voiced concern with the law. Every one has eluded to the fact that criminals don’t open carry!!!
There has always been open carry in the state of Ky where I was born and raised got to Tx as soon as I could. Anyway there has been a problem and when I moved here I was shocked that Tx was not an open carry state. In fact in Ky you only need a CHL to conceal carry.
I had a neighbor who I thought was a really nice guy and sensible. Recently he learned that I had a concealed carry license. His face immediately turned stony and scary. He called all CCL holders disgusting names and accused us of being dangerous to society. He stressed that crazy teen-agers should not be allowed to carry in schools, showing his ignorance of facts. I tried reasoning with him. No way he would admit maybe he was wrong. Now he hates me. So be it, no great loss for me.
Sometimes, correct that, all the time, you can’t fix stupid.
It’s amusing to see so much angst regarding open carry in Texas. In my North Eastern state, you can open carry without any permit (a CCW is only required for concealed carry) and we have no problems associated with it. Why would it be any different in Texas?
We here in AZ have open and concealed carry without permits. It’s wonderful actually.
That’s a nice assed piece … js
As for myself,have had a CHL for years,and as for open carry,I am glad that it has finally came to pass,though I very seriously doubt that I will ever open carry for the very reason that I do not want to advertise that I am armed which is my prerogative,but it I get stopped for any thing,I tell the officer that I am armed and hands in the open and explain when I am reaching for ID and CHL license and wait for acknowledgment.I so far have not had an officer to request my weapon or do they seem intimidated that I am armed at all.
When I was growing up in Texas,almost every Pick-up you would see would have at least 1/4 Rifles in a rear window rack and most were loaded,we were in a small country town.We were a family of 7 and we were taught weapon safety almost from birth,and to reinforce that,if we walked into the house with bolt closed,our Mother would reinforce the safety with her size 5 foot to the rear kicking us out the door,that doesent take long to remember what is a no-no!
Honestly, I don’t see the being able to stop you and check to see if you have a permit lasting long. Essentially that makes it a terry stop, which the SCOTUS has found to be unconstitutional. You can’t stop me from driving my car just to see if I am licensed when that is a privilege. Carrying a gun is a right. United States v. Black is the best court case regarding this. Only reason it doesn’t apply yet to Texas is that it was heard in the 4th Circuit Court of appeals and Texas is in the 5th Circuit. I also believe that the 6th Circuit has had a similar case with the same outcome. Northrup v. City of Toledo Police Dep’t, et al says that where a state allows its citizens to carry a weapon, it cannot assume that you are carrying illegally by default. It sighted a 3rd Circuit Court of Appeals case Florida v. J.L., 529 U.S. 266, 272 (2000). This case the court basically compared open carry in a state that allows it by permit to carrying a wallet. “that Ubiles possessed a wallet, a
perfectly legal act in the Virgin Islands, and the authorities stopped him for this reason. Though
a search of that wallet may have revealed counterfeit bills—the possession of which is a crime
under United States law—the officers would have had no justification to stop Ubiles based
merely on information that he possessed a wallet.” Will I open carry, not likely, do I feel that it is illegal for an officer to stop me just for carrying? I feel that at least 3 of 12 Circuit Court of Appeals have already dealt with it and affirmed that it is a violation of your 4th amendment rights for an officer to automatically assume you do not meet the requirements of the law to lawfully carry a weapon. Still don’t see the big deal anyways, more states don’t require a permit at all than those that do.